i think one thing! if the sabbat his coming in it own book,that could be a really good addition to v5 and man you got some cool idea!
Matthew Dawkins has now confirmed that the Sabbat will be playable again in V5 for those who were interested. With the greater focus on cults and religion I’m gonna be interested to see how they evolve the Sabbat.
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Make sure to note that he also said ‘at some point’. It’s not like there’s a Sabbat book suddenly going to be announced. And we’ve know they want to do playable Sabbat since, well, literally the second or third interview with WW.
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To be sure, but with the greater focus on religion and people asking about it more and more, the need to write-up the Tzimisce I wouldn’t doubt say it’s terribly far either.
As for it being a certainty that they’d do it, I don’t know. Read back on this thread, opinion was split over whether they should be brought back or not and I feel that’s not a sentiment isolated to this forum either.
I for one want them back as soon as possible, but there are others who were happy to see them shunted to the side.
I wouldn’t think the Tzimisce being written up for the PG will indicate anything, considering part of what that got kicked back to Modiphius for involved the Sabbat-side Tzimisce, and the current mandate of 'all the clans need to be playable in all the sects, and not gatelocked. I would still expect it to be some time off.
As far as should or shouldn’t they come back, yeah, that’s an individual expression. Personally I feel like they need to return to being the antagonistic NPC faction, given what the Chicago book posits they’re becoming, if the Lasombra’s reason for leaving the Sabbat is to be believed.
I think it’ll indicate something, even if it’s why so many of them felt a need to leave the Sabbat. It’s the thing that bugs me the most about the Lasombra joining the Cam. All we get is very vague notes about how the Sabbat was becoming excessively vicious, that the prophecies weren’t coming true and that the Gehenna Crusades weren’t going well.
To me it all felt a little, weak, I guess. Without getting the perspective from within the Sabbat the defection felt hollow. Given that the Tzimisce arguably more so than the Lasombra needed the monstrosity of the Sabbat to survive (at least traditionally) I’d hope for some more details.
That was a position posited by others above and personally that bugs me a little. I really like the Sabbat as a concept, and whilst the new cults stuff definitely helps, their unique perspective was always an interesting one.
I dunno, I guess it’s just me, but it makes a lot of sense. The Sabbat are becoming more vicious and, most importantly, fattened on the blood of the elders they’re killing. The Lasombra are being pragmatic like they always do, and are going to get out before the youngers turn on them and start eating them en masse. And also with what many assume is their Antediluvian showing up on the battlefields of the Gehenna War and hoovering them up like a vacuum, it’s showing that they are now seeing the Sabbat’s mission will most likely fail.
IT also gives a terrifying thought of Sabbat fattened on the blood of elders… until that one elder takes over the body that ate it. The Sabbat, returning with OTHER things at its head in its war heroes… makes for a great antagonist.
Don’t get me wrong they’ll be great antagonists but at the same time it’ll be a shame to lose the traditional Sabbat style of play. The power of the Vaulderie, the games of instinct, the conflict between the Orthodox and Militant Sabbat, etc.
I for one would’ve liked to see the old Sabbat survive, but as I posited above I reckon we’ll end up getting something closer to the Black Hand. Elite groups of zealots that act like terror-cells furthering their fanatical interests, rather than a major sect.
That way they can either be the NPC boogy-men or they can be a faction to play. I think it’d also give you the option for some interesting covert/spy themed interactions as well that would pair well against the SI.
After all, the Black Hand were secretive even before the SI, now most of the Sabbat gets purged and those that aren’t subtle soon follow? Yeah that sounds like an ideal time to assume power.
As regards the Lasombra and the Tzimisce, it’s logical to an extent. But the Sabbat is meant to be a cult of fanatics, blood-bound fanatics at that. The idea that the going gets tough, that they finally have the war they’ve been preparing for, and their pillar clans just run? Strikes me as a bit of a let down to be honest, hence my wanting the inside story as it were.