Bandits and Neutal heroes

The Elder Scrolls: Call to Arms - Rules Questions
1

Bandit parties may not recruit any Hireling that is either unique (*), or that belongs to more than
one faction.
Are neutral models (no Faction Special Rule) count as faction?
SC Quartermaster, Dunmer thief, P-s of Arkay, Breton fire mage - each of them not unique, and have 2 icons (neutral and another one).
Can I include them to bandit army?

2

Hey,

Neutral does not count as a faction (see p92, Neutral Models in the core rulebook).

Bandits can hire a model that only has the Neutral icon, providing that other hiring restrictions are met.

If a model has a second faction icon in addition to Neutral, it can be hired by Bandits providing that the other hiring restrictions for Bandits are met.

Things get a little difficult once we consider models like the Quartermaster, Dunmer Thief and the like. The Bandits rules prevent hiring of models with multiple faction icons unless one of them is Bandits - these models all have multiple icons, neither of which are Bandits.

However, if we look at the Neutral Models section it states that neutral models are not treated as a faction in their own right. If we are to not treat Neutral Models as their own faction, does that mean that the Neutral Icon does not count and therefore, they can in fact be hired by Bandits?

Thanks!

3

Hey Dom,

Can you clarify why purely Neutral models can’t be hired by Bandits? There’s nothing I can see in their Party rules to suggest that (provided that the model in question isn’t unique).

Thanks,
Jim

4

The bandit faction card specify that they can’t recruit unique hireling or hireling belonging to multiple factions. From what i understand, neutral models with no other factions can still be recruited by bandits?

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5

Yup. Thanks for the spot. That was a mistake on my part. I’ll get the original comment updated now.

I have bolded the sections that are actual rules, as I get a little lost in the weeds with rules commentary. I think where I got lost last time was the whole ‘neutral models not being treated as a faction’ point. Where does that stop? Is it just the lack of a special rule or does it extend to the icons too?

I believe the intention (looping it back to the Bandit point) is that these models cannot be hired by Bandits, so we need to treat the Neutral icon as a faction icon despite Neutral models not being treated as a Faction in their own right.

What do folks think?

6

Hi Dom,

My interpretation is the opposite to be honest. To try and break down how I think it’s supposed to be:

  • Neutral doesn’t count as a faction in of itself so models with the Neutral faction icon and ONE other faction icon can be taken by bandits (examples are the Stormcloak Quartermaster, Dunmer Thief etc.). This is due to the Neutral icon being ignored as it relates to the Bandit party composition rules (because Neutral isn’t a faction according to the previous response).

  • Models with JUST the Neutral faction icon can be taken as part of a Bandit party as Hirelings as per the regular Neutral model rules (there is nothing in the current Bandit Party composition or Neutral model rules that would suggest otherwise). Otherwise we’re cutting off Bandit access to things like the War Dogs, which I can’t imagine would be the intent.

  • Bandit Parties are still precluded from taking unique models (with the * symbol).

  • Bandit Parties may still take Adventurers as Hirelings provided that they only belong to a single faction (Adventurers) and don’t have the (*) unique symbol.

7

Neutral not being a faction but having a faction icon just feels odd. We are both acknowledging as something else other than a Faction but giving them the identifier of a faction in the form of a Faction Icon.

I’m pretty sure we agree on the points on what they can actually hire mechanically (note the two bolded statements in my earlier post). I’ll need to fix the wording on the second point, as the initial card does not reference faction icons.

8

I don’t personally mind there being a ‘factionless faction icon’ in that respect (if the consensus is indeed that the Neutral ‘faction’ isn’t actually a faction) as it’s still a useful shorthand for denoting how it operates mechanically with relation to party composition (plus Neutral models still have their own explicit rules with regards to them being Hirelings etc. even if they’re not actually a ‘faction’ per se).

The only area I can see that needed an explicit ruling (good one for an errata update) is whether Neutral is, in fact a faction with regards to the Bandit Party composition (so those few examples of a model with both a Neutral and another faction symbol as per the original query). Everything else covered is already encompassed by the rules. As it stands, I’d concur with your bolded statements.

9

Hey,

I had some time at the end of the day, so let’s put a bow on this one.

  • Bandits can hire a model that only is Neutral, providing that other hiring restrictions are met.

  • If a model is Neutral and has a Faction icon, Bandits may hire that model following the regular hiring restrictions. This is because Neutral is not a Faction (despite having an icon) and therefore, does not meet the criteria for not being hired set out in the third Party Composition criteria for Bandits.

  • Q: Does Neutral count as a Faction, as there is a Neutral Faction icon?
    A: No. The icon in this case is used to denote that the model is Neutral for the purposes of Hirelings and Party Composition rules.

I think that works?

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